CS-550p Echo

[1957hd5]

I know I have mentioned here that I have several chainsaws, but I was in a farm store and saw a saw marked down from 520.00 to 239.00 and couldn't help myself.
It is brand new I haven't even started it yet. The last new saw I bought was a dolmar 5100 and it never ran right until I pulled the limit caps and gave it more fuel. I intend to do the same since I have read a lot about echo saws being way to lean from the factory and have a tendency to do a meltdown.
I suppose that would void the five year warranty? And is that five warranty for real anyway?

[bgsengine]

I know I have mentioned here that I have several chainsaws, but I was in a farm store and saw a saw marked down from 520.00 to 239.00 and couldn't help myself.
It is brand new I haven't even started it yet. The last new saw I bought was a dolmar 5100 and it never ran right until I pulled the limit caps and gave it more fuel. I intend to do the same since I have read a lot about echo saws being way to lean from the factory and have a tendency to do a meltdown.

Pure myth - that's just people that like Stihl or Husky bashing the machine - I have yet to see *any* of the machines we sold - chainsaw or otherwise - melt down - saws are supposed to be serviced and set up before delivery to the customer - if your HD store did not do that, they are not following good practices. Very rarely do they need any tweaking when properly serviced and fueled to begin with - We have 3 case studies on that over 3 years - 2 professional users, one with 2 550's and one with 1 - The guy with the 2 550's buys "whatever is cheap" 2-cycle oil at the hardware store and cheapest gas they can find at gas station - some of that oil they were using was 6 years old Homelite 32:1 mix oil.. They had endless problems with their 2 saws they kept bringing them in to be 'readjusted" because they were too lean - 9 times out of 10 a new fuel filter, dumping out the old gas and fresh shop mix (89 octane, Echo Power Blend 2 stroke oil) resolved the problem.. for a few months.. then they'd be back again - In frustration I replaced the standard fuel filter with a bigger surface area Husky 503-443201 filter, and tweaked the carbs rich so they were about 10% off their proper power band - then things lasted them much longer.

The other guy - buys only Echo Power Blend mix oil from us, buys the *recommended* 89 octane gas, and runs his saw hard every day - and has never , EVER needed a re-adjustment of the carburetor - brings it in every year for a tune up (plug and filters, replace lines after 2 years) - and has never had a problem - in all 3 saws they are used daily, all day (firewood cutter and logger) - and even with them being "lean" , they never yet melted down

Also, the carb adjustment on these particular saws is *very* different from your ordinary run-of-the-mill carburetor - Got to set the mixture screws much different, MUST have an accurate tachometer, and be properly warmed up - they do need to run a few minutes before they warm up to develop full power, but tweaking them rich results in carbon problems at the exhaust ports.

I suppose that would void the five year warranty?

Absolutely.

And is that five warranty for real anyway?

Absolutely - In fact, we just replaced a customer's saw with a whole new one 2 1/2 years later - they overtightened the bar nuts and pulled the bar studs out of the crankcase housing - even though it was really sort of their fault, Echo approved the warranty anyway.
Not to mention, the ignition module is a LIFETIME warranty (and for trimmers/brushcutters, the drive shaft is as well lifetime warranty)

Following the procedures by the book, we have never had a warranty claim denied yet, so far have never yet seen a blown echo (but several huskys and stihls burned up meantime by the same owners.)

[1957hd5]

Thanks for the facts. I bought this at a farm store, the truth is they shouldn't be selling saws.
It was so cheap I couldn't believe it.
No chance of it being set up, employees all appeared to be little more than kids.
So, do you approve of me running av gas 100 octane? I have used it in Stihls, husky,dolmar,Pioneer,and Tanaka saws and seems to burn clean and don't worry about it going bad very quick. I also have only used 100% synthetic Mobil racing 2t oil for several years. That is about to end as they quit making it. I have used echo premium synthetic and liked it.

[bgsengine]

Sounds good to me - Echo premium ad AV gas you probably won't go wrong , and I would bet , you won't even need to tweak carburetor - as long as you are aware to give it minimum 3 mins warm up = run it at idle. dont worry at hesitation during rev up, just give'er time to warm up a bit, and I would bet no tweaking needed at all.

too many new users don't really understand the warm up period is important on all new EPA compliant machines after 2012 , but once they get used to it, it becomes a non-problem,.

[1957hd5]

Ok, I'm gonna trust you on this. It is gonna be a long drive for me to Pennsylvania to get you to cover under warranty if it toasts

The reason I wanted to richen up is I have read on other forums that Echo comes lean from the factory and when it has a problem the dealer says you ran it on straight gas..

I am practically obessive compulsive about my saw mix. special can, wrote all over with sharpie, duct tape in two places on handle and I add fuel colorant to the mix just to make sure it is real blue...

Again you are right those forums are dominated by Stihl and Husky fanatics and everything else is crap..

I guess I will get another can for this saw and use Echo what ever you said, I still want to use Mobil t2 in my other saws.
Thanks again

[bgsengine]

Ok, I'm gonna trust you on this. It is gonna be a long drive for me to Pennsylvania to get you to cover under warranty if it toasts

The reason I wanted to richen up is I have read on other forums that Echo comes lean from the factory and when it has a problem the dealer says you ran it on straight gas..

I am practically obessive compulsive about my saw mix. special can, wrote all over with sharpie, duct tape in two places on handle and I add fuel colorant to the mix just to make sure it is real blue...

Again you are right those forums are dominated by Stihl and Husky fanatics and everything else is crap..

I guess I will get another can for this saw and use Echo what ever you said, I still want to use Mobil t2 in my other saws.
Thanks again

As Mobil T2 is a synthetic - You can run it, if you can find on the label where it is meeting JASO FD performance standards or better - thats the only requirement for mix oil Echo has for warranty purposes Power Blend is a synthetic oil as well - and I would not be surprised if it is the same stuff as your Mobil oil.

A lot can depend on the dealer - Echo has extensive dealer education programs and tear down check sheet that is *supposed* to be filled out by the Echo trained tech during tear down and analysis, but all too many will just simply say "You ran it on straight gas" to get out of spending the *time* to do a proper diagnostic analysis - which Echo has a very slim labor allowance (It really does not take that long for an experienced tech to do anyway.) so you would need to be dealing with a dealer that actually , as I said before, goes by the book, does a proper analysis (Lot of meltdown damage failures can all look very much like a straight gas problem, but they are not.) - and the process for tuning carburetor on this particular saw is a little more complicated than most - so a lot of dealer techs just won't take the time to do it right, and "hope" it lasts. The other impression of the saw running "lean" is because they don't let the saw warm up first before putting it to use - they *are* lean, but no more so than any other 2-stroke out there that meets EPA Emissions standards. Just that they happen to be somewhat unique (along with the CS-600P which is a similar design to the 550) and with proper customer education, as we do with ours (or try to) , they rarely ever have a problem.

There's an awful lot of so-called technicians out there that can't tell the difference between a 2-stroke melt down caused by overheating (Commerical cutter running a straight shaft without the grass shield (not warranty) or missing line limiter from the shield (warranty if missing since new), for example, or a power blower with plugged cooling vents (not warranty - maintenance issue), or an air dam missing at the factory or a missing or loose fastener letting something shift and block air flow...(warranty) ) or caused by straight gas (both have very similar characteristics , but there's some small clues easily overlooked that tell the difference)

[1957hd5]

When you tune an Echo saw do you have a special tool to pull the caps or are you working within the confines of the limiter caps?

When I was about 25 I seized up a XL12 Homelite by leaning it out too much, learned a lesson that day. That was about 32 years ago.
Old saw was tough though got it broke loose, richened up a little and used it for several more years until I could afford a quieter, more comfortable, faster cutting (need I go on)? saw. I still have it, Dad bought it new in 1971, I cut hundreds of cords of wood with it. It is the main reason I am mostly deaf today. Only sissies wore ear muffs back then, maybe I should have been a sissy

[bgsengine]

When you tune an Echo saw do you have a special tool to pull the caps or are you working within the confines of the limiter caps?

Yes we have special tool for removal of limiter caps without damaging them, most times we are able to adjust within the limiter cap range - One thing that could be possible if you are paranoid about them running lean - don't adjust the carb at all but if you can carefully remove low speed limiter cap and then give it (the cap) about a 1/8 turn clockwise and re-install, gives you a little bit of room to richen things up slightly - They are usually pegged at, or almost at, their maximum rich travel - especially at a lower elevation where things will be a bit leaner. Rarely if ever does a new saw need to be tweaked - they are all test run and adjusted at the factory before being boxed and shipped. Only twice have we ever had to pull a cap on *any* Echo machine and give it that 1/8 turn extra room to adjust it a little bit richer.

When I was about 25 I seized up a XL12 Homelite by leaning it out too much, learned a lesson that day. That was about 32 years ago.
Old saw was tough though got it broke loose, richened up a little and used it for several more years until I could afford a quieter, more comfortable, faster cutting (need I go on)? saw. I still have it, Dad bought it new in 1971, I cut hundreds of cords of wood with it. It is the main reason I am mostly deaf today. Only sissies wore ear muffs back then, maybe I should have been a sissy

Yeah - but modern mix oils and modern metallurgy and machining techniques tend to make that sort of thing a thing of the past - It is kind of hard to get a saw running *right* and still burn up from being lean - if it runs properly within its normal operating RPM ranges, they're generally getting enough oil, when the right oil is used.. and on the CS-550P , their ignition system has a rev limiter built in (You'll notice it mis-firing as the spark cuts out from it, when they go past 13,500 RPM) CS-550P Operating range - Idle 2800-3000 RPM, WOT 12,000-13,500 RPM ... With the digital ignition having that limiter feature, you can't really over-rev them - keep in mind that running *any* 2-stroke at max top no load RPM can burn them up , if you run them that way with no load for long enough... TO be on the safe side, figure 10 seconds max. (Adjust top no load on a 2-stroke by adjusting needle when at idle in 1/8 turn increments, rev it up to check max RPM) - Most of the time once you start cutting and have a load on the thing, the RPM's come down to where it is not over-revving anyway and runs great...

But as I mentioned at the start of the thread - that one guy that insisted on using cheapest possible gas and oil mix they could find, usually ended up with filters clogging up, and the saw would keep going lean on them... but again even with that, they never burned one up... mainly because of the rev limiter built in to the electronic ignition module... which is why they kept bringing it back for re-adjustment - Couldn't get out of its own way running that lean. (But they did trash a Husky they got a month earlier before they got the Echo saws.)

[1957hd5]

I finally started using this saw and love it. Shortly after started running I noticed the chain needed tightening a lot. I checked it and it was slinging oil on a stump.
I switched chains to a woodland pro .325 - 78 link . .50 ga and it was really throwing chips. Then it started smoking and bogged down in the cut. No it was not on backwards.
Clean green oak log well off the ground. I cut the oil with diesel . Checked filter turned oil wide open still have the same problem.
Any ideas?

[bgsengine]

Original echo bar? Or is it an Oregon or other brand of bar? if it is not OE Echo branded bar then a universal bar mount code does not have the oiler hole in exactly the right place - too much chain stretch (78 links seems like a high count..) and the bar can be adjusted so the oiler hole is blocked - some of them were actually designed to feed oil in between the bar studs rather than a small hole in the side of bar rail - so that is something to have a look at, as well - You need to make sure your bar is correctly positioned in relation to the oiler galley to get oil to the chain. That would be my first thoughts - if bar and chain combo is not quite right for the bar mount, it's all to easy to block off the oiler galley and the bar and chain won't get oiled - all the oil that does get out would just drip down the bottom. As they have an outboard sprocket with inboard clutch, you can run them without bar and chain on, and verify that oiler is pumping oil out the oil galley hole. (If it was an outboard clutch, it's always a bad idea to run them without bar and chain - when you rev them up and then idle down the clutch can spin loose and go flying - I have a 1 inch wide slotted hole in a wall to prove the point! but with an inboard clutch and outboard sprocket, sprocket keeps clutch in place even if it does get loose.)

Also, was the sprocket replaced to get it to run the .325 chain? If so, was the correct retainer washer and e-clip installed? - If the wrong parts are put in or installed wrong, it is possible for the clutch drum to disengage from the oiler worm drive.